A reader opinion on May 30 contained several points that must be challenged:
Voter ID: The writer states that voter ID is a matter of honor but offers nothing to explain what he means. Contrary to the repetition of a few hyped up allegations, voter fraud is not a problem. The allegations are always made by Republicans against Democrats. On the other hand, Voter ID will reduce voter turnout of several groups of people who mostly vote Democratic.
Political perks: Contrary to the writer’s allegations, Congress has the same health care plan as all Federal employees and retirees including the writer. Its retirement package is not nearly as generous as detractors claim - the writer has a better retirement package (CSRS) than members of Congress elected after 1983. In America, Congress is the law making branch of government. It would be against the Article I of the Constitution for the President or Supreme Court to determine Congressional pay.
Entitlements for lazy cheaters: Entitlement fraud amounts to a very small share of the federal budget. Additionally, most of the fraud is by providers – not receivers.
The writer finishes with a rambling, moralistic rant full of lazy thinking. Read up on “appeal to emotion” to learn the fallacy and danger of this type of argument.
Robert Espenson
Nisswa
Comments (36)
Add comment"....Read up on “appeal to
"....Read up on “appeal to emotion” to learn the fallacy and danger of this type of argument...."
Robbie....you should take your own advise.
BTW....According to the USDA food stamp fraud "costs the US taxpayer $750 million dollars a year". Only a liberal can consider $750 million dollars a year be "...a very small share...".
GetaGrip, interesting article
To be honest I've never heard of such a thing before, but when I think about it, are not most people's opinions and written expressions based solely on their emotions to a given subject? Anyway, thanks for enlightening me!
As the original letter
As the original letter states, most of that fraud is by providers, not end users. So how much of that $750 million a year is by providers?
Person gets food stamp card for $100 worth of groceries.
Grocery Store buys that food stamp card for $75.00 cash.
Grocery Store rings $100 on that card.
Grocery Store gets $25.00 profit in cash.
Who is guiltier? Person who sold the card, or the Grocery Store who used it to commit fraud?
It's not that $750 million is a very small share, it's just that the entire $750 million isn't fraud committed by the benefit recipient.
OD......Either way $750
OD......Either way $750 million is $750 million. In your scenario, both are guilty of committing fraud. Arguing who is more responsible for the fraud is a benign argument. It's analogous to arguing which of two robbers grabbed the most cash as they as they departed the bank vault following the robbery.
It's difficult to conclude that "most" of the fraud is committed by the providers when both are willing parties in the transaction that is defined as fraud. Ergo......Mr. Espenson opines the same garbage he accuses of the previous writer.
The fact is, is there is substantial fraud; unless of course you consider $750m/year something other than substantial.
In perspective:
Afghan War cost is $5-6 Billion a month!
And I hear there is plenty of fraud going on there.
lakelander,
Your hero is in charge of that war and has chosen to extend it. Please take that up with him.
and if he didn't, he'd be
and if he didn't, he'd be blasted by the right for "cutting and running". It was a damned if you do /damned if you don't scenario.
smartguy,
are you taking the same bus as lakelander to Wisconsin?
I'm wondering if
the rabid left/union thugs and their out of state supporters will stage riots and storm the capital, if Walker wins tomorrow.
Sorry to let you down, but
Sorry to let you down, but I'm staying local. That third job isn't going to work itself. Enjoy your summer.
Ah, Come on Fair and Balanced...
Any time you can get a dig in (all in fun) to the Land of the Green Bay Packers, it's a good day...
You're a Minnesota Vikings Fan, correct?
You enjoy it
too, smartguy. And dutch, the last guy that admitted to being a Vikings fan on here got disowned by his family, banished and ambushed by fishhead for associating with evil rich people. I think I'll not come out of the closet just yet!
Let's see, Aaron Rogers gets older, Packers get older...
And then the Minnesota (yes I said it, Minnesota, not Los Angeles) Vikings start doing well...
I'm not a band=wagoner.
I'm always on board with the Minnesota Vikings, low and high...
SKOL...
Unfortunately
I think Scott Walker will win. Is it my imagination or does Walker, Ryan, Pawlenty, and Cantor(Randy Klinger) all have that pasty white, Eddie Munsterness about them???
Haven't seen any rallies for Walker,
So unless his supporters come out and go to the polls tomorrow, I predict he loses and moves to Cali!
Per usual,
NO documentation or evidence of the rabid right's accusations.
Walker stays
The reason that Walker will likely stay is that the average Wisconsin voter doesn't have the retirement pension and medical benefits of the state and local govt worker. He also knows those benefits are underfunded, and that he will taxed to pay for them.
The election is not about union busting; it's about sound financial management.
Rolf
Did I just read your last sentence right??? or do I need stronger glasses. WOW
"Haven't seen any rallies for Walker"
Since when do you see "rallies" for republicans or conservatives, the turnout for Walker will be large. Some polls suggest that he may win with a vote total larger than he won the "real" election with. If that is the case then it will mean that he garnered the vote of some of the disenfranchised union people who find it better to keep their dues in the pocket than furnish union officials with their lavish lifestyles.
Lavish lifestyles:
People frankly are envious of lavish lifestyles among union officials and corporate officers. But they don't have much power to do anything about either. Today they can voice their opinion, and let the chips fall where they may.
Hundreds of supporters
gathered to hear his final words of encouragement at Serb Hall in the south side of Milwaukee. Meanwhile a pro-Walker Marine was arrested at a democratic rally attened by Slick Willie (no Monica)! Apparently you can't be arrested for "civil unrest" if you're just urinating, defecating, or having sex inside the capitol building!
I thought smartguy was
all right when he said he was too busy to ride with lakelander and cheyenne on the bus down there. But now I'm thinking he voted with an absentee ballot.
Only plutocrats
like the Koch brothers and their sycophants are allowed to have 'lavish' lifestyles, didn't you know lakelander? Those working class peasants are getting too uppity.
In 2010 about 50% of eligible voters cast a ballot in the gubernatorial race in WI. Today's turnout is estimated to be at 60-65%. Doubtful that many 'disenfranchised union people' will be voting for Walker.
In the GOP fantasy world,
Women get paid what they deserve. Men need higher salaries, because they need nicer cars and have to pick up the check on a date. And there is no "war on women!"
Obama cinched the female vote today by the Senate's vote!
Four more years!
That's because
a bunch of the Dems. are on the public dole and never feel the pain.
Farm boy
You read it right. Retirement medical and pension benefits need to be based on employee/employer contributions and investment returns, not on labor negotiations which produce results which have no relation to reality.
From the looks of the election results
in Wi., we'd better ship a bunch of porta-potties to Madison for the rabid union protesters real soon. They'll be wanting to pretend they are in Cairo or something.
OOOPs
I suppose the locals are drowning their sorrows?
Honesty...The Taxpayer versus the Users...
I'm willing to call a time out...
Why?
We're into a situation where the payers (tax payers) are asking honest questions of the users (county askers).
Why this matters?
It's a difficult equation to solve...
I have folks I know on both sides, and why...
My family owns property since the late 1800s in Crow Wing County. We've paid our property taxes reliably since then.
I personally have experienced users at the county office who I would question why are you there?
Then I step back, think about it, and ask, why are they there?
They are there to ask in need, and it's valid.
As a Christian, it's something that I would contribute to.
Not a Social Issue like Marriage or Voter Id.
I consider that the denial of marriage to any citizen of the United States a civil rights issue.
I personally consider in this order...
1. Citizenship
2. Religion
I do not put my religion above my citizenship.
Citizenship means all of the United States of America are equals.
Religion means you choose to practice a religion, respect it's principles, and you DO NOT FORCE, that belief system upon any citizen of the United States of America.
As a person who practices religion, you respect those who do adopt your religion. However, you do not disrespect those who do not. Freedom of religion is a fundamental right!
Now onto another personal item...Health Care...
If you're healthy (yet), then it's good. If you don't, then it's bad...
I then have an experience where an ancestor has their bank account drained by medical expenses and it dries up. That bank account would have been adequate years ago. However, in a non-profit nursing home, it was consumed fairly fast.
That's the issue now...
Save all your life, and then get it drained in a few months.
That folks, is the issue...
Don't believe me, ask around.
Fair, sure, it's a 4 letter word...Think about it...
Photo IDs
Thursday is easy enrollment day at Central Lakes Collage,just bring $20 and a PHOTO ID.Does anyone think CLC is trying to keep democrats from being educated.