ST. PAUL (AP) — A proposed constitutional amendment to require a photo ID for Minnesota voters is part of a surge of similar legislation nationwide, much of it springing from a conservative organization that’s well-known to politicians but operates largely out of public view.
Six states enacted a strict photo ID requirement last year, and this year lawmakers in 31 other states are considering it. Minnesota’s Republican-controlled Legislature actually passed such a requirement last year but Democratic Gov. Mark Dayton vetoed it — prompting its backers to seek an amendment on the November ballot that Dayton cannot block.
The dispute over voter ID is deeply partisan. While Republicans cast it as a common-sense requirement that foils voter fraud, many Democrats say it would make voting more difficult for the poor, minorities, the elderly and disabled — constituencies that often favor them.
The American Legislative Exchange Council, or ALEC, has offered its ideas on voter ID for anyone interested in taking them. Established in 1973, the organization offers state lawmakers a menu of model bills on a range of issues: from business-friendly changes to the civil legal system to reducing regulations backed by environmentalists.
About 2,000 legislators around the country are ALEC members, joined by 300 corporate or private members. Companies such as Wal-Mart, AT&T and ExxonMobil pay between $7,000 and $25,000 to belong, and for various fees such companies can sit on task forces that draft model legislation.
ALEC approved its model policy for voter ID in 2009. Cara Sullivan, a legislative analyst, said in an email that it was “just one of hundreds of models” that ALEC had produced.
Sullivan wrote that ALEC has “never campaigned to promote these policies in the states.”
Rep. Mary Kiffmeyer, R-Big Lake, is chief House author of the voter ID constitutional amendment as well as the bill Dayton vetoed last year. She’s also Minnesota state chairwoman for ALEC. A former Minnesota secretary of state, Kiffmeyer said she didn’t use the model bill for her legislation and never worked on the model with other ALEC members.
“I might have a novel brain in my head and have a unique thought,” Kiffmeyer said. “I am not dependent upon somebody else’s idea.”
ALEC provided a copy of its voter ID model bill to The Associated Press. Kiffmeyer’s 2011 bill is not identical, though there are several similar sections about ID requirements, counting provisional ballots and issuing a free ID to those over 18 who don’t have a valid driver’s license.
Tim Penny, a former Minnesota congressman who now teaches at the University of Minnesota, said it’s not uncommon for both conservative and liberal groups — whether industries, unions or advocacy groups — to offer prepared legislation to lawmakers from both political parties. He said, though, that he’s unaware of a direct liberal counterpart to ALEC, with its wide range of policy interests.
ALEC members are “not buying legislation because these ideas still have to be brought back to a legislature and be debated in a process,” said Penny, who served in Congress as a Democrat but later shifted to the state’s Independence Party. “If the ideas are objectionable, that ought to be discovered.”
Doug Chapin, an elections expert at the University of Minnesota, said a voter ID debate that had simmered for years got significant new traction after Republicans nationwide made large gains in legislatures in the 2010 elections. Chapin said there’s been large-scale sharing of ideas in these new majorities.
“It’s pretty clear that it’s becoming a common plank,” Chapin said. Republican legislators in 31 states “did not come up with this idea independently,” he said.
Five states passed a strict photo ID requirement last year: Wisconsin, Tennessee, Kansas, Texas and South Carolina. In each case, lawmakers integral to passing the bills have either confirmed or reported ALEC ties. A sixth state, Mississippi, enacted a constitutional amendment requiring photo ID in an initiative process begun by a lawmaker reported to have served on an ALEC task force.
Minnesota critics of photo ID point out there are few signs of widespread voter fraud in the state. The Minnesota County Attorneys Association said there were 157 total convictions of voter fraud from the state’s 2008 and 2010 elections. Joe Mansky, the Ramsey County elections manager, said the amendment would likely take extra time and money to implement and could prevent some from voting.
Democrats and liberal groups have called the push purely political.
“It’s a concerted effort to make it more difficult for people who vote for Democrats to get to the polls,” said Minnesota Rep. Ryan Winkler, DFL-Golden Valley.
Democrats complained of ALEC’s influence earlier this session. In February, Dayton vetoed four Republican-backed bills that would have made sweeping changes to the state’s civil legal system; he said then that three of the four bills were directly influenced by an ALEC manual. When asked about the claim, a Senate GOP spokesman said he could give no immediate comment.
Scott Hargarten, a 25-year-old organizer with Occupy Minneapolis, said his group plans to protest ALEC at the Capitol this month as part of a national action. Hargarten said ALEC became a focus of Occupy after recent news reports on the group and its work.
The voter ID issue “has this much momentum because it increases the powers of corporations, and the powers of the Republican party, at the expense of the citizen,” Hargarten said.
Comments (89)
Add commentdisenfranchised voters?
157 legal votes were nullified by the convicted voter fraud people. What do you think? Did they catch and convict every illegal voter? Most of the dead voters, multiple vote voters, the ACORN votes went to Democrats. Two Harbors helped defeat Norm Coleman when they counted more votes than they had registered voters! And the judge didn't throw any of them out!
I'm telling you, there are already warehouses full of "missing" wink wink votes waiting for November 2012. 2/3 of those votes are for the democrat candidate. I wonder why they never caught the guy in Washington state who put thousands of votes for Gregoire in a warehouse. Wonder how that person knew they were all for the Democrat??
Show me one person who couldn't vote due to voter registration, just one. Wouldn't vote is different. Why wouldn't they? Because they are not eligible!!!!!!!!!!! and didn't want to get caught!!!!!!!!
It's so darn easy to cheat right now. We have to do this.
Democracy Should Be Held Priceless
While Tim Penney's measured analysis of ALEC's role in state sessions across the nation is accurate, it is impossible not to see their puppet strings tied to Marionette, er, Rep. Kiffmeyer (R - Big Lake). I have seen her debate on the matter of voter ID and there is no way she came up with even the idea of voter ID, much less the legislation, on her own. Her quote in this article saddens me, because as a women with legislative power, she could actually use her own ideas instead of paraphrasing the legalese that Wal-Mart et al. built. Which brings me to my comment's title; democracy should never be for sale. It is the founding principle on which our United States, including Minnesota, stands. The fraud that was reported in 2010 constituted 0.00005% of all ballots cast. The majority of those fraudulent votes were cast by felons who were not aware that their civil rights are not restored immediately after their sentence is over. There is a way to eliminate this fraud, and that is by explaining to felons before they are released that they cannot vote for x amount of years. Not voter photo ID. I highly recommend that readers visit the League of Women Voters Minnesota website, www.lwvmn.org, and watch the documentary they produced last fall. The documentary is an excellent, factual, nonpartisan presentation of what voter fraud is, and what the so called "solution" of voter photo ID would mean for all Minnesotans.
Which things are we required to show ID for???
I find it interesting that folks complain because someone is asking that we show an "official" picture ID in order to vote. In the piece on voter ID it is stated, "it would make voting more difficult for the poor, minorities, the elderly and disabled" and this brings a question to my mind. Are we required to show such an ID for access to other things in our every day lives?
If we would like to purchase an 'adult beverage' we must show ID! If we want to purchase a smoke we must show ID! If we want to purchase a Minnesota hunting, fishing, trapping, etc license we must show a Minnesota drivers license as ID! I had Charter out to my home to install cable and the person setting the appointment over the phone told me that I would have to show my ID to the rep when he arrived at my house in order for the work to be done!
Do any of those things come anywhere close to comparing to the responsibility of the vote? I did some digging on the internet to learn how many folks in Minnesota of voting age had drivers licenses. I did not write it all down, but my recollection is that in the range of 80% of Minnesotans have a drivers license.
The requirements to vote placed on the citizens of the United States of America have changed dramatically since our country was founded. Maybe we should go back to something similar to what the requirements were 200 plus years ago or possibly just back to around 1900! I wonder how much screaming and hollering we would hear then? Maybe we should be required to register to vote a minimum of one or two weeks before an election! Is it too much to ask that we take a little responsibility and get ID and register early?
Just my 2 cents worth!
80% is not Democracy
oldandretired, I love your user name. But, let me respond to your argument. Yes, it is easy for you to get an id, you've probably always had one. Just because it is easy for you and the people you know, does not mean it is easy for everyone. Not by a long shot (for more info, check out the website I mentioned in my earlier comment). It is not that people are irresponsible, but that they cannot afford $35 for documentation, or are not comfortably retired and cannot take time from work to get a photo ID. It is truly very difficult for some Minnesotans to get a photo ID, and it is not because they are lazy or irresponsible voters. That's just the fact of the matter. Democracy means everyone eligible to vote may do so. If you don't care that 20% of eligible Minnesotans might not be able to vote, then why care about a fraud rate of 0.00005%?
It's the principle of the matter
When registering to vote, the verification system is strong enough. An ID is often shown then to verify your address. What is next then? Poll tax? Literacy test?
voter fraud rate of 0.00005%
And I have never driven faster than a posted speed limit.
PolicyGradMPLS, you are wrong on us being a democracy
We are not a democracy, we are a democratic republic. And if our criminal elected officials need to put in a rule to stop cheating (LMAO) then it needs to happen.
If we were a democracy, your argument would stand, but since we are a democratic republic and do need to control cheating at the polls by both sides of the political scale, a change is/was needed, depending where you are.
PolicyGradMPLS
Sorry but you have some weak excuses why people cannot or will not get an ID. Yes it is laziness. Lazy and cheap. I wonder how much some of these people who "cannot afford" to get an ID spend their money on booze, cigs, cell phones, etc... And you are right lake, it is the principle; something dems know too little of.
Pay no attention to the
Pay no attention to the corporations behind the curtain. Just vote yes on whatever legislation they produce through ALEC. It's for our own good.
To i_disagree_with_dems
Can you explain more how being a democratic republic rather than a democracy undermines my argument? I don't see how if we were a democracy, fraud would not matter, where as because we are a democratic republic, it does.
To JohnBrown
I took your comment to be sarcastic, and as a signal that you disagree with me, but I don't see how that refutes anything I've said so far. Speeding gets you a ticket, while voting illegally gets you a felony charge complete with five years in jail and or up to a $10,000 fine. People can go around and register as Tim Tebow all they want, but I don't see how anyone would risk losing five years of their life and up to $10,000 of their money just to add a ballot. Also, in the situation of illegal immigrants, there's no reason for them to cast an illegal ballot; the last thing they want to do is draw attention to themselves, right? I'm not saying that voter fraud never happens, but the majority of the instances in Minnesota are not due to intentional abuses of the voter system, and obviously, did not successfully cast an illegal ballot.
To pdnet15
Where is your proof that people are not going to get proper IDs? My proof is from the League of Women Voters documentary found on their website, and the footage of the state Senate hearings regarding SF 1577, the voter photo ID bill. Also, if you think there are a bunch of people that are too lazy to get an ID, doesn't it make sense that they'd also be too lazy to vote, and then really, what is there to worry about? To your point about people spending money on vices, alcohol, cigarettes, and cell phones can be purchased down the street from 9am-9pm, whereas getting an ID requires traveling to specific government offices that have limited hours of operation. Some people in outer Minnesota will end up having to drive 80+ miles to get to the nearest government office. With gas costing as much as it does, you cannot tell me that someone unable to make that trek is being "cheap." I don't think having small vices warrants the punishment of being unable to vote...as a Republican (which I'm just assuming you are), surely you agree that people have the right to do whatever they want with their health? Also, cell phones and internet access are standard to a good quality life in this day and age, and help people improve their lives. Much like the national effort to expand public roads to rural areas earlier in the 20th century, access to these higher standards allowed for a huge boom in productivity for all Americans. And finally, like I said earlier, I'm not trying to argue that there is not fraud, but rather that the teensy tiny amount of fraud that exists will not be solved by requiring a voter photo ID. Anyone ever heard of a fake ID?
Anyone Ever Heard of a Fake ID?
Voter photo ID is simply not the right response to address the type of fraud that this state has seen. It will not solve the teensy tiny amount of fraud that has occured. It will, however, make it extremely difficult for some groups of Minnesotans to vote. This is the intent of the bill, not to stop voter fraud. There are better and less restrictive ways to eliminate fraud, and we owe it to ourselves and each other to take the time to do it right.
Democracy vs Republic
There seems to be some confusion on the part of our "let's let everyone vote regardless" folks. For information sake:
A republic and a democracy are identical in every aspect except one. In a republic the sovereignty is in each individual person. In a democracy the sovereignty is in the group.
Republic. That form of government in which the powers of sovereignty are vested in the people and are exercised by the people, either directly, or through representatives chosen by the people, to whome those powers are specially delegated. [NOTE: The word "people" may be either plural or singular. In a republic the group only has advisory powers; the sovereign individual is free to reject the majority group-think. USA/exception: if 100% of a jury convicts, then the individual loses sovereignty and is subject to group-think as in a democracy.]
Democracy. That form of government in which the sovereign power resides in and is exercised by the whole body of free citizens directly or indirectly through a system of representation, as distinguished from a monarchy, aristocracy, or oligarchy. [NOTE: In a pure democracy, 51% beats 49%. In other words, the minority has no rights. The minority only has those privileges granted by the dictatorship of the majority.]
To go a bit further:
The distinction between our Republic and a democracy is not an idle one. It has great legal significance. The Constitution guarantees to every state a Republican form of government (Art. 4, Sec. 4). No state may join the United States unless it is a Republic. Our Republic is one dedicated to "liberty and justice for all." Minority individual rights are the priority. The people have natural rights instead of civil rights. The people are protected by the Bill of Rights from the majority. One vote in a jury can stop all of the majority from depriving any one of the people of his rights; this would not be so if the United States were a democracy. (see People's rights vs Citizens' rights)
In a pure democracy 51 beats 49[%]. In a democracy there is no such thing as a significant minority: there are no minority rights except civil rights (privileges) granted by a condescending majority. Only five of the U.S. Constitution's first ten amendments apply to Citizens of the United States. Simply stated, a democracy is a dictatorship of the majority. Socrates was executed by a democracy: though he harmed no one, the majority found him intolerable.
So, for those of you who say there is no diffeence, you are totally wrong. Politicians or whomever (probably left wing educators) have been trying to convince us that we are a democracy for a long tine and the problem is that most of our young people do not know the difference. It will be a sorry day when and if we are legally declared a democracy.
One of you stated, "When registering to vote, the verification system is strong enough. An ID is often shown then to verify your address. What is next then? Poll tax? Literacy test?" Since when is a utility bill or some similar thing proof of CITIZENSHIP???? Thus, I say that those of you believing such tripe need to be educated on how folks actually can and do cheat (illegal or fraudulant registration) when it comes to voting. Wouldn't it be wonderful if our young folks actually were taught about this great country of ours factually!
I'd better stop before my blood pressure goes through the roof!!
Some people do not see problems
I use to think everyone had an ID, and if they didn't they could get one easily.
Unfortunately, I found out that isn't true.
And as far as showing ID for other things. There are people that do not have "adult beverage", hunt, trap, or fish or afford Charter.
Unfortunately for some it is not laziness either.
I found out there are people that barely have enough food (sometimes not enough), people that go shopping for food as soon as they get a check.
I live at a place that has people that are poor, elderly, disabled, students, and/or minorities. And it could hurt some of them, even if they have free IDs. I have had to vouch for a student to vote before.
I do think they should have free IDs no matter what, as long as they are used so heavily in our society. However I thinking plastic ID's may be becoming an outdated technology. They can be lost or stolen, it takes 2 weeks to get them in the mail, people have to go to specific locations to get them-less locations than the places to vote.
Nathan Steffenson
Response to - Some people do not see problems
As I understand it, there may be a provision for a free ID card. Regardless, go back to my statement of WHO voted initially. Check it out if they could afford an ID!
Don't Go oldandretired!
Your input was extremely well said (except for insinuations that liberal educators are coordinated in trying to convince America's youth that we're a democracy, that sounds odd and I haven't seen any such thing). I truly appreciate the detailed explanation of a democracy vs. a democratic republic. It feels a bit, however, like democratic republicanism would be opposed to something like voter ID because it denies a minority of people sovereignty, using the right to vote as a proxy. Also, the majority group-think is that voter fraud is everywhere, all the time, in all elections, and there are too many brown people and poor people voting for Democrats. So then, in our democratic republic, opposing this viewpoint is encouraged, correct? Also, the Bill of Rights that protects the minority includes freedom of speech which has been legally allowed to mean a boatload of things, and thus should/could apply to voting. Also, I never said that democracy and a democratic republic were the same thing. I just didn't see how voter fraud mattered in one but not the other. I agree with you that it's a good thing we don't have a straight democracy, otherwise the esteemed and valued minority to which I belong would have been condescended to by the legislative majority...oh, wait...
@PolicyGradMPLS
I wasn't disagreeing with you. I was making fun of you. I was making fun of you for making up facts.
You watched a youtube video that you agreed with and felt confident in throwing out FACTS like a fraud rate of 0.00005%. For that I was laughing at you. I found enough humor in your post that I decided to respond.
You should go chain yourself to a DMV door in Wisconsin with eyolf. You guys and your facts. good grief.
Registering to Vote
On the note of proving citizenship, when one registers, they can write any old thing they want on a form. That's not evidence of fraud, that's evidence of wasting ink and paper. Once that form is received, it is verified by database, verification post cards are sent to the given address twice, and if returned without appropriate reply, the name is flagged. There's more about the system on the Secretary of State's website. Everyone in favor of voter photo ID keeps slinging the word fraud around, and insisting that the groups that will be harmed by voter photo ID are lazy and cheap, but no one has actual proof of this. Just saying it doesn't make it so. But if you go to the www.lwvmn.org website, the State Legislature's website (to watch senate hearing proceedings regarding SF 1577, and to the Secretary of State's website, you'll see boatloads of proof showing why voter photo ID isn't the right method for combating voter fraud. And it's certainly not useful enough to amend the official, long-standing, state constitution for all time. Administrative practice sure as heck does not belong in the Constitution.
@JohnBrown
I didn't just watch a video on YouTube. I extensively researched state records. It is pure, unadulterated, fact, that of the 2.921million + votes cast in the state of Minneosta, 160 (rounded up from 157) were questionable. That is, if you are comfortable with doing factual research and math, approximately 0.00005%. I can't explain it any clearer. I don't know how you thought that I got that percentage from the League of Women Voters Minnesota video, because it is not mentioned there. Thus, it is clear that I did not just watch one YouTube video and decide to hold on to that. Further, you still have yet to cite any anything. at. all. And what the heck is an "eyolf"?! I still find it interesting that whenever anyone uses recorded fact to support their argument, the person with the least amount of information has the most hateful and meritless things to say.
a fraud rate of 0.00005%
You said "a fraud rate of 0.00005%," no?
The problem isn't how clearly you explained anything. The problem is that you do not type words that reconcile with what you are so thoroughly explaining. Very few cases being investigated have little to no correlation with the number of crimes committed.
If there were no convictions the voter fraud rate is 0.00%. By looking at the 0% fact I can conclude that no person has ever committed voter fraud in the State of Minnesota and there is no reason to have any safeguards in place. Case closed, next issue.
Oh, and eyolf is a poster who reminds me of you. He worries about FACTS but makes stuff up as he goes along.
PolicyGradMpls
Ignore john brown...too much talk radio...not enough respect for your facts and research. when you have nothing, you make fun of people, I guess.
eyolf is another person who posts on this site.
johnbrown likes to make inflammatory statements then hopes some of us jump all over him so he can complain, probably on some local talk radio station.
Excellent post and we are listening out here...you know, the snobs who value higher education and protecting the rights of others.
@JohnBrown
I guess the difference between you and me is that I don't have as active an imagination regarding how many cases may or may not have gone undetected. Also, with regard to facts, you can look at the Brennan Center for Justice website, they've done massive research on voter ID. And with regard to fact, a member of the Secretary of State's office has been trying to figure out how Minnesota Majority has gotten their numbers because they don't appear to be from the state database by any stretch of the mathematical imagination.
@lakelander
Thank you so much! I needed to hear that. The way some people behave when debating policy issues honestly scares me. If JohnBrown met me on the street, what would he do to me?
approximately 0.00005%
I would assume that your % numbers are correct in relation to the parameters used. However, as was also stated, postcards (or similar) are sent out after registration and if returned undeliverable are sent again. If there is still no response, the name is flagged in the voter rolls and I would assume that at the next election the person may have a problem voting. Let us assume that those that are returned as not deliverable (no such person at that address or address unknown) are therefore fradulent registrations. How many such registrations happened in the state of Minnesota at the last election or two? If there were large numbers, those votes which were counted and can not be 'uncounted' may have been responsible for the election of someone that should not have actually been elected. Those, I assume, are not among the 150 or so who may or not have been convicted of voter fraud!
So, require voter registration by official ID (MN driver license or state or federal issued ID in lieu of driver license) in advance of the day of election by at least a week. This way, all the doom and gloom sayers etc will no longer have a complaint.
Additionally, as I mentioned earlier, why don't you folks who think everyone should be allowed to vote go back and research what the original requirements to vote were!
@oldandretired
I don't think that it is right to assume that undeliverable verification cards can be considered fraudulent. It's my understanding that a large number of these are due to people moving, or being foreclosed on. Those people who receive the post cards are sent them twice before any election held after registration, with the exception of same-day (as far as people that register shortly before elections, I don't know how that works). So by the first election in which they could vote, the Secretary of State's office has checked their info twice. People that are flagged as a result of their cards being returned undeliverable or no such address, are not able to vote until cleared, so those people are not casting votes that cannot be uncounted. I think this is getting to what you were saying but let me know if I interpreted it wrong. Also, I don't necessarily care what the original requirements to vote were, because we're no longer in those times and will never go back. We should always strive to be better, not placated by the status quo...unless the status quo is as good as can be, of course.
PolicyGradMPLS
You're welcome. It is good to have a new face on here.
Oh, don't worry about meeting John Brown on the street. He probably hangs out in his mom's basement buying baseball cards online for his collection that he started in 1952.
And as you appear to be a stellar woman (or man), if he was out on the street, he would be hanging his head down in shyness at such a meeting. Being anonymous makes some people brave. Heck, me, too!
i can explain it
Democracy, the people vote, all people vote. In a democratic republic, only documented legal citizens vote for our criminals, I mean politicians. You have to be a legal citizen and alive to vote.
Therefore, when cheating occurs and dead people vote, your elected officials need to put in laws and regulations to stop that from occurring. And that isn't just one party doing it, that is all parties doing the cheating.
In Wisconsin, the ID cards are free, why cant they be free here?
Are free cards too expensive for the welfare recipients to buy?
Everyone that gets out of the house to vote, can get themselves out of the house ONE TIME to get a FREE voter id card. If you can afford to go to the voting booth to vote for free, you can afford to get out of the house and get a voter id card.
I.D.
My mom has a picture ID which cost her $11.00.
You know what? It was important to her to have one
that she made it a priority. She lives in a building with
people who get government assistance. and she does not. She has less
money than they do, but that ID was important to her.
It can be done.
@i_disagree_with_dems
There are already laws against using dead peoples' names to vote. The cards are "free" but there are a couple back door ways that they cost money. The state produces these cards at a cost (estimates vary but one can look at other states to see what an approximate cost can be) but without explaining where the money will come from. The bill that passed was suspiciously lacking a fiscal note. Also, there's a weird catch-22 that results from requiring these forms of id because some forms of id require that an individual have a birth certificate and/or marriage certificate to confirm their identity. Sounds good, but if someone doesn't have either certificate, they have to obtain one to then get a proper voting ID. The catch lies here - to get marriage and birth certificates in some states, one has to show a photo ID...Maybe if voter ID is implemented, there could be some sort of amnesty period at first? And believe me, I know cheating happens on both sides, in the south, a high-level NAACP branch executive was convicted of voter fraud and sentenced to 10 years for casting ballots for 10 dead people. But, that's not voter impersonation fraud, which is the only fraud photo ID would stop, it wasn't committed by an average voter, and it wasn't committed here in Minnesota. Kind of like the "if it ain't broke, don't fix it" saying, our voting system isn't broken, it just needs a little duct tape and I don't want to butcher up the Constitution for an identification method that will probably be out of date in ten years anyway.
I know I disagree with you and many others here, but I really do enjoy debating this and getting to know more about other perspectives.